Kumoricon Location / Area Questions

[Cassiopeia]

Those of us who stay at the Red Lion can gaze across the river and be reminded of Kumoricon 2006!
*shudder*

And with fond memories! (At least for me. It was my first year and a great introduction to Kumoricon!)

That was my first year too. I didn't know about the problems or have anything else to base it off of, so I thought it was awesome. xD

[DarkStar]

Cons: I didn't mind the location in Vancouver, but my problem with having it in Washinton in general is SALES TAX. I freaking HATE sales tax. In the dealers room they mainly just pushed the prices up to accommodate, so everyone ended up paying basically regular price on a lot of things that could have been below regular price (manga) had the con been in Portland.

Do what I did! I was about to make a large purchase (over $200) and the vendor stated that the sales tax was built-in. I stated that I was a non-resident of Washington State and was exempt from paying the sales tax (per Washington State law). They declined to remove the tax so I left the purchase on the table.

I refused to purchase from any vendor that wouldn't remove the sales tax, built-in or not. Many ended up doing so when I pushed the issue and presented my Oregon drivers license (state-issued ID is required for verification).

You used to be able to request a refund of sales taxes paid in Washington State, however they have since changed their policy and "will not make refunds directly to consumers when the collection of sales tax is at the discretion of the seller (i.e. sales to nonresidents)." (http://dor.wa.gov/content/FileAndPayTaxes/ApplyForATaxRefund/)

[Rathany]

Last time we were at Vancouver we sold out the Red Lion there, which is the old convention center hotel.  If we are going to sell out a second convention center hotel, we might as well sop up all that event space as well  As for how to best use it...  While we have various potential layouts, only the 2011 board can actually commit to a one of them.  I don't want to say too much, as I am neither Hotelchan or Prog, but I will say that the City of Vancouver is very interested in helping us out in any way possible.  Their assistant mayor showed up to our big meeting with both hotels and followed on the walkthroughs to find ways that the city could help us out.  

Many people are very interested in working hard to make sure that 2011 is awesome.  

[DarkStar]

Many people are very interested in working hard to make sure that 2011 is awesome.  

One word: Catbus

[@random]

Cons: I didn't mind the location in Vancouver, but my problem with having it in Washinton in general is SALES TAX. I freaking HATE sales tax. In the dealers room they mainly just pushed the prices up to accommodate, so everyone ended up paying basically regular price on a lot of things that could have been below regular price (manga) had the con been in Portland.

Do what I did! I was about to make a large purchase (over $200) and the vendor stated that the sales tax was built-in. I stated that I was a non-resident of Washington State and was exempt from paying the sales tax (per Washington State law). They declined to remove the tax so I left the purchase on the table.

I refused to purchase from any vendor that wouldn't remove the sales tax, built-in or not. Many ended up doing so when I pushed the issue and presented my Oregon drivers license (state-issued ID is required for verification).

You used to be able to request a refund of sales taxes paid in Washington State, however they have since changed their policy and "will not make refunds directly to consumers when the collection of sales tax is at the discretion of the seller (i.e. sales to nonresidents)." (http://dor.wa.gov/content/FileAndPayTaxes/ApplyForATaxRefund/)

Personally, I don't understand why in 2010 any state uses a tax system as regressive as sales tax, but that's just me. And I applaud your stand on principle.

[Mr Silmero]

and we return to my first con location....should be interesting.

[Rathany]

If you've seen the Leverage episode The Double Blind Job, parts of it were filmed there.  Actually, the filming signs were up while we were doing our walkthroughs, but I never caught a glimpse of anyone.

[childofthemoor]

We're moving to my hometown! I love Esther Short Park -- on Saturday, there will probably be a Farmer's Market, which should be interesting.

[SandPuppeteer]

We're moving to my hometown! I love Esther Short Park -- on Saturday, there will probably be a Farmer's Market, which should be interesting.

The last time the con was there, the Famer's Market was up and running on the weekend. It was actually pretty awesome. And I'm sure the people with booths really appreciated the extra business.

[Washougal_Otaku]

They are just a couple of blocks away.  There will be shuttles going between the two.

[acton]

I question the wisdom of this decision on may levels. First of all the I been to mewcon, the road is not very well lit at night and is more that a short walk; a great place for muggers or rapist lot of foliage to hide in. Downtown Vancouver is dead at night the one Mexican restaurant and a sprinkling of fast food downtown the rest are dives and bars. Anything decent is north or all the way into east Vancouver. Public transit is dismal from Portland; there only one bus from max line to down town Vancouver Saturday through Monday. The result is long bus / Max ride from Hillsboro, though not very good neighborhoods. Not a place one wants to be in Cosplay.

[JeffT]

First of all the I been to mewcon, the road is not very well lit at night and is more that a short walk; a great place for muggers or rapist lot of foliage to hide in.

The city is adding additional lighting along the path between the hotels for us.

[EveofAbyss]

It may be a bit too far fetched an idea, but depending on the staff/volunteer size next year, would having an escort be a possibility? For those who are insecure about the walk between hotels or what not, perhaps a yojimbo or bulky volunteer could be designated as a late night escort between hotels.

[AllyKat]

 I don't want to say too much, as I am neither Hotelchan or Prog,

Does this mean I have a new nickname?
 

[Negima]

Many people are very interested in working hard to make sure that 2011 is awesome.  

One word: Catbus

I second this motion.

[Washougal_Otaku]

I question the wisdom of this decision on may levels. First of all the I been to mewcon, the road is not very well lit at night and is more that a short walk; a great place for muggers or rapist lot of foliage to hide in. Downtown Vancouver is dead at night the one Mexican restaurant and a sprinkling of fast food downtown the rest are dives and bars. Anything decent is north or all the way into east Vancouver. Public transit is dismal from Portland; there only one bus from max line to down town Vancouver Saturday through Monday. The result is long bus / Max ride from Hillsboro, though not very good neighborhoods. Not a place one wants to be in Cosplay.

Wow, you're so far off from the truth that it's sad.  I live rather close to the '11 con site; it's not even close to what you're saying, except about lots of the locations closing somewhat late, but even that is an exaggeration.  It's not downtown Portland, but you know what?  There's more thhan likely to be a mugging or raping in downtown Portland than any part of Vancouver.  And it's totally safe for cosplayers.  There were no issues at all in '07 when we were there.

You're also wrong about the buslines.  If you go via the yellow line, it'll come to the #4 in the C-Tran system, which is all 7 days of the week.  There's also the #44, which has limits and, I think, only runs on the weekdays.  There's other options that can be used, but the Yellow+#4 is the best way to do it.  Trust me on the long busride thing, it's not that bad.

[bunny_jean]

Many people are very interested in working hard to make sure that 2011 is awesome.  

One word: Catbus

I second this motion.

Thirded

[Rathany]

 I don't want to say too much, as I am neither Hotelchan or Prog,

Does this mean I have a new nickname?
 

Yes

[SandPuppeteer]

You're also wrong about the buslines.  If you go via the yellow line, it'll come to the #4 in the C-Tran system, which is all 7 days of the week.  There's also the #44, which has limits and, I think, only runs on the weekdays.  There's other options that can be used, but the Yellow+#4 is the best way to do it.  Trust me on the long busride thing, it's not that bad.

Wow, they changed it? Right after the 07 con, they shut down weekend runs. Did they realize how utterly messed up it was and reinstate weekend trips?

[lychee-twist]

I question the wisdom of this decision on may levels. First of all the I been to mewcon, the road is not very well lit at night and is more that a short walk; a great place for muggers or rapist lot of foliage to hide in. Downtown Vancouver is dead at night the one Mexican restaurant and a sprinkling of fast food downtown the rest are dives and bars. Anything decent is north or all the way into east Vancouver. Public transit is dismal from Portland; there only one bus from max line to down town Vancouver Saturday through Monday. The result is long bus / Max ride from Hillsboro, though not very good neighborhoods. Not a place one wants to be in Cosplay.

I've been to Kumoricon 2007, Mewcon 08-09, and Mewcon 09-10. I have no idea what you're talking about. It's really not that dangerous, and there are a ton of places to eat around there. There's a Subway, a Starbucks, Safeway, and a Burgerville a couple of blocks away. For K-Con 2007 my friends and I stayed at the Shiloh Inn with fabulous results, and that was far more of a walk to the con each day than it is between MEWcon and kumoricon. Even the restaurant at REd Lion has great food itself. Awesome clam chowder.

I seriously have no idea what you're talking about with the danger levels. And when it comes to the bus and max lines and cosplay, we had a discussion about that very subject no the "Cosplay and Max" thread.

I'm very conservative about safety as I have a nurse and a Firefighter/EMT for parents as well as a cop for a brother. I've heard a LOT of stories. I have never had any bad feelings about that area, and if you feel unsafe, I recommend just travelling in groups, keeping your head up, your eyes alert, and perhaps buying a canister of mace if you really feel it necessary.

That said, I really do think some sort of transport bus between the two is a really good idea. There are some of us who are physically unfit for travel back and forth for several different reasons. We need to consider the people who can't move as well as others.

BTW there's a Thai place around there that has FABULOUS food. Seriously delicious.

[lychee-twist]

Its only like 30min further north.

That estimate is on the more traffic-heavy side really. Avoid rush hour and you can be up there in around fifteen to twenty minutes I would say.

Do avoid 1-5 at 5PM, though. The Seattle exit clogs to holy crud.

[VulgateCycle]

I'll probably go. And drag a friend along with me.

[Kurohime]

I-5 does clog terribly at rush hour.  I've been an hour late into Seattle before because of it.  Fortunately it's a holiday weekend.  I didn't have any problems with traffic in 07. 

And it's not to everyone's taste, but there's nothing wrong with stockpiling picnic food in your room.  It worked well for me and mine this year (after the long, long lines to get food at Sakuracon, it's almost a must!).

[acton]

I question the wisdom of this decision on may levels. First of all the I been to mewcon, the road is not very well lit at night and is more that a short walk; a great place for muggers or rapist lot of foliage to hide in. Downtown Vancouver is dead at night the one Mexican restaurant and a sprinkling of fast food downtown the rest are dives and bars. Anything decent is north or all the way into east Vancouver. Public transit is dismal from Portland; there only one bus from max line to down town Vancouver Saturday through Monday. The result is long bus / Max ride from Hillsboro, though not very good neighborhoods. Not a place one wants to be in Cosplay.

I've been to Kumoricon 2007, Mewcon 08-09, and Mewcon 09-10. I have no idea what you're talking about. It's really not that dangerous, and there are a ton of places to eat around there. There's a Subway, a Starbucks, Safeway, and a Burgerville a couple of blocks away. For K-Con 2007 my friends and I stayed at the Shiloh Inn with fabulous results, and that was far more of a walk to the con each day than it is between MEWcon and kumoricon. Even the restaurant at REd Lion has great food itself. Awesome clam chowder.

 

I was at the Red Lion for Mewcon 2009-10. I was the person with the big Hello Kitty. It was rainy and dark I missed the turn into the parking lot. I stuck to driving. Except for the waterfront, I would not like to walk that street at night.  As for the food scene, I do not like over inflated hotel prices. Starbucks is neither dinner nor fast food and I despise Subway. It is cheaper just to go to Safeway and by bread and sandwich meat.  I want no less than three course, reasonable to good quality at reasonable price for dinner nothing else will do. Yes I am a food snob.  Somebody suggest burger and fires or Subway for dinner they might be wearing it if I am in a bad mood. ;0 The nearest decent pizza place is about two mile away past main and anything else is back to Portland or near I-205.

[mellonemrys]

@Tom, I was hit by a thought this year, that maybe having a list (possibly with pictures) of good photoshoot places around the con space would be a good idea. I know when I was looking at the locations chosen by groups for this year I was a bit disappointed by them, like the Hetalia group could have had an awesome shoot at the World Trade Center. I really don't know other than the park whats around the '11 location though. Perhaps we could get together and scout out a few additional places to spread out the shoots? Any suggestions from the Vancouver crowd?

Also, remembering from '07 although it was kinda creepy just how deserted the town was at night, but it was DESERTED. Me and a few friends walked around at four in the morning in a city we'd never been in (probably not all that smart really), but we never ran into anyone...nor had any problems. There's easy parking, decently easy food, and that park was amazing for photos. Some of the other hotels around will be giving con rates in addition to the Red Lion and the Hilton, the businesses and the city are excited to work with us, and we're now a two hotel con! I am super excited for this next year!

Just a note: There will be problems with every single hotel you can find in the area. Even if they have a 'Convention Center' those spaces and areas aren't always meant to be used all at once by the same event. Moving to be a two con hotel was a good choice at this point, and especially when the hotels and the city are so excited to work with us to make sure that you the attendee has a GREAT time, I don't have a problem with coming the extra 15 mins from Beaverton.

[TomtheFanboy]

@Tom, I was hit by a thought this year, that maybe having a list (possibly with pictures) of good photoshoot places around the con space would be a good idea. I know when I was looking at the locations chosen by groups for this year I was a bit disappointed by them, like the Hetalia group could have had an awesome shoot at the World Trade Center. I really don't know other than the park whats around the '11 location though. Perhaps we could get together and scout out a few additional places to spread out the shoots? Any suggestions from the Vancouver crowd?

That's a really good idea. I am rubbish at photoshoots. I trust others to attend and get good pictures, one schedule per convention is enough for me. I'd love to have somebody with me on the drive to help scout for them as well. I'll be sure to bring my cameras as well so we can get sample shots. I'm sure the waterfront and the massive back deck the Red Lion has will be great for some photoshoots.

[Washougal_Otaku]

You're also wrong about the buslines.  If you go via the yellow line, it'll come to the #4 in the C-Tran system, which is all 7 days of the week.  There's also the #44, which has limits and, I think, only runs on the weekdays.  There's other options that can be used, but the Yellow+#4 is the best way to do it.  Trust me on the long busride thing, it's not that bad.

Wow, they changed it? Right after the 07 con, they shut down weekend runs. Did they realize how utterly messed up it was and reinstate weekend trips?

I'm not sure I know what "change" you're talking about.  It must be the Yellow line, because the #4 is the busiest route in the whole system.  It's been an all-7/as late as Midnight busline for years.

[mellonemrys]

With all the same questions about walking directions and which park was which this year I thought it might be good to have some of the better locations posted with pics so the cosplayers could figure out ahead of time which location would work best for their series. Also with so many abbot this past year and most likely fewer locations plus fewer people who know the area it could be very useful.

[Washougal_Otaku]

This year the park thing will be EASY!!!  It's a giant park, about 4 square blocks in "area" with a giant clock tower acrossed the street from the Hilton.  Even Ryoga Hibiki could find it.

I'm not sure if I understand what you're saying in your last sentence.

[SandPuppeteer]

You're also wrong about the buslines.  If you go via the yellow line, it'll come to the #4 in the C-Tran system, which is all 7 days of the week.  There's also the #44, which has limits and, I think, only runs on the weekdays.  There's other options that can be used, but the Yellow+#4 is the best way to do it.  Trust me on the long busride thing, it's not that bad.

Wow, they changed it? Right after the 07 con, they shut down weekend runs. Did they realize how utterly messed up it was and reinstate weekend trips?

I'm not sure I know what "change" you're talking about.  It must be the Yellow line, because the #4 is the busiest route in the whole system.  It's been an all-7/as late as Midnight busline for years.

The change I'm referring to was back in 2007, C-Tran cut weekend trips to Portland. There was no more running between the yellow line and Vancouver on the weekends. It took effect immediately after labor day weekend that year.

[Washougal_Otaku]

Okay, I think I know what you're talking about.  Yeah, that was just changes to the routes.  Tri-Met did that to me last year on the way to the Hilton.  I was under the impression that I'd be able to loop around PSU and get off in front of the hotel, which it does, but for some reason they stopped the loop part early that very night, so I had to walk, and got lost.

[Kimiski]

It may be a bit too far fetched an idea, but depending on the staff/volunteer size next year, would having an escort be a possibility? For those who are insecure about the walk between hotels or what not, perhaps a yojimbo or bulky volunteer could be designated as a late night escort between hotels.

My dad said this should happen too, when he picked us up from Kcon '10 and I was telling him about how 2011's going to be set-up. But the issue with that is again, staff/volunteer size and if a vehicle was used as an escort, where the money for that would be coming from. You'd have to have more than one, an they would have to fit a fair number of people, so....  but I agree with the second half of your statement at least. Perhaps a yojimbo or a couple along the path? Again, depending on volunteer/staff size.

[AllyKat]

but I agree with the second half of your statement at least. Perhaps a yojimbo or a couple along the path? Again, depending on volunteer/staff size.

In an unofficial capacity... I'd suggest an alternate option, depending on the amount of
Yojimbo we have to work with.

What about stationary yojimbo lining the walk way between the convention spaces?
This allows the areas to be monitored at all times and also gives those walking them an
added security.

Just a thought, not an actual proposal.

[Kimiski]

but I agree with the second half of your statement at least. Perhaps a yojimbo or a couple along the path? Again, depending on volunteer/staff size.

In an unofficial capacity... I'd suggest an alternate option, depending on the amount of
Yojimbo we have to work with.

What about stationary yojimbo lining the walk way between the convention spaces?
This allows the areas to be monitored at all times and also gives those walking them an
added security.

Just a thought, not an actual proposal.

Yeah, something along that path needs to happen, it's the problem of exactly what you can do with who and what you have.

[The_Geek]

I'm rather apprehensive about the move. Does Kumoricon have a good reputation with hotel staff? I remember 2009 as being somewhat hellish in regards to how some people felt that they were being treated. I certainly have not heard many complaints this year, but next year... New Vicinity... Are we going to have any problems?

[Kimiski]

I'm rather apprehensive about the move. Does Kumoricon have a good reputation with hotel staff? I remember 2009 as being somewhat hellish in regards to how some people felt that they were being treated. I certainly have not heard many complaints this year, but next year... New Vicinity... Are we going to have any problems?

We were there in 2007, and everything was fine. I don't remember any problems with hotel staff. And remember, they were the ones who begged us to come back (as said in Closing Ceremonies)

[AllyKat]

Yeah, EVERYONE there remembers us, and they are SUPER excited to have us back... not to mention both hotels have hosted events similar to us in style (Gamestorm and MEWcon) but just not in size, though they are very aware that the size will be the difference.... to give you an image of me at my meetings with these hotels over the past months, I think the words I said most were;

"We plan to have OVER 9000* crazy cosplayers invading your hotels... thats OVER 9000* people glomping, laughing, loitering and generally having a good time but doing it in your hotel space. Think you can handle that?"

Okay, so maybe I didn't say over 9000, but I did say 6000 repeatedly, and I made big wavy hand gestures as if to say "This area will be filled to the brim with happy people!"

I just kinda pulled the numbers from the air, because I wanted them to get the idea that this was not some tiny little business convention, this was a big group of awesome Anime and Japanese culture fans converging on the Downtown Vancouver area and basically taking it over. The imagery got across, and I know they will be ready for us. Rest assured, if I am still in this position, I wont stop illustrating the massiveness of our convention to these two hotels!

-Ally

[Kimiski]

It makes me so happy they were the ones to approach you guys!! I cannot wait till the 2011 con!!!

[EveofAbyss]

That's super assuring to know that the hotel is as eager to have us back as the majority of us are to return. This augurs beautifully for next year.

[Midnight Divine]

Yeaaah, the next con will be Epic!

[Rathany]

Yeah, EVERYONE there remembers us, and they are SUPER excited to have us back... not to mention both hotels have hosted events similar to us in style (Gamestorm and MEWcon) but just not in size, though they are very aware that the size will be the difference.... to give you an image of me at my meetings with these hotels over the past months, I think the words I said most were;

"We plan to have OVER 9000* crazy cosplayers invading your hotels... thats OVER 9000* people glomping, laughing, loitering and generally having a good time but doing it in your hotel space. Think you can handle that?"

Okay, so maybe I didn't say over 9000, but I did say 6000 repeatedly, and I made big wavy hand gestures as if to say "This area will be filled to the brim with happy people!"

I just kinda pulled the numbers from the air, because I wanted them to get the idea that this was not some tiny little business convention, this was a big group of awesome Anime and Japanese culture fans converging on the Downtown Vancouver area and basically taking it over. The imagery got across, and I know they will be ready for us. Rest assured, if I am still in this position, I wont stop illustrating the massiveness of our convention to these two hotels!

-Ally

I am stilling LOLing forever about how the hotel staff were lying in wait for us when they heard that Kcon was going to have a presence at Gamestorm. 

We have a great rep with the hotel and with the city. 

[AllyKat]

YEAH SERIOUSLY!

They didn't even wait for us to get any of our stuff in the room and they
were already asking for us to sit down with them! It was really amazing!

[Kimiski]

YEAH SERIOUSLY!

They didn't even wait for us to get any of our stuff in the room and they
were already asking for us to sit down with them! It was really amazing!

That really is soooo cooool!! *has a fangirl moment* xD

[EveofAbyss]

Very awesome. Positive relations are always a pleasure to hear about. 

[Washougal_Otaku]

I'm rather apprehensive about the move. Does Kumoricon have a good reputation with hotel staff? I remember 2009 as being somewhat hellish in regards to how some people felt that they were being treated. I certainly have not heard many complaints this year, but next year... New Vicinity... Are we going to have any problems?

We were there in 2007, and everything was fine. I don't remember any problems with hotel staff. And remember, they were the ones who begged us to come back (as said in Closing Ceremonies)

The Hilton staff LOVED us in '07.  We were their very first multi-day con, and we PROVED that they could hold one successfully.  I'm confident that we'll have the same reception with them.  As for the Red Lion, some of us on staff are also involved with MEWcon, which as I recall, was born at this Red Lion.  I'm sure there'll be some good relationships there, and what there isn't there, it WILL WORK!

[superjaz]

I just saw a red lion ad for a breakfast buffet for 5 bucks, con now I dont know if its at the red lion we are going to be part of but our con could shut that down !

[AllyKat]

LOL

Yes indeed, the Red Lion does a roaring start breakfast for $5 at this hotel...
I am going to make sure they understand fair warning that they will most likely be
so swamped it is crazy. Hopefully they will heed us and prepare tons of extra food!

-Ally

[Kimiski]

^ Owww, ouch.... they gonna be swaaampppedddd with hungry cosplayers

[steelychan]

ok, a few questions. i wanna start looking at hotel reservations now. is there some kind of passcode that will give me a discount? if so, what is it? and, when can i get my con badge for 2011? i kinda want to pre reg now. but i dont see it up and running yet.

[Negima]

YEAH SERIOUSLY!

They didn't even wait for us to get any of our stuff in the room and they
were already asking for us to sit down with them! It was really amazing!

That part I missed a detail or two.  When did the VanHilt come up and ask to come back?