Author Topic: Disability Needs?  (Read 22237 times)

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Offline Shadow Tec

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Disability Needs?
« on: March 09, 2009, 09:38:15 pm »
Hello all, I am this year's Disabilities Coordinator again (I served in this capacity for Kumoricon 2008).  I have three main questions for staff and attendees alike, all comments, criticism, and questions are welcome but please keep it constructive in nature.  That way myself and anyone who assists me can make the experience a memorable one for our attendees who may have disabilities or physical difficulties.

What do people with disabilities need from Kumoricon staff to make their experience a great one?

What have you observed about our ability to meet the needs of our attendees with disabilities?

Is there anyplace else on the forums that this thread may be better posted?

Offline BlackjackGabbiani

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Re: Disability Needs?
« Reply #1 on: April 26, 2009, 03:40:03 am »
A nice quiet space for cooling down. Ducking in the bathroom isn't really enough.

Offline Deviant Spider

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Re: Disability Needs?
« Reply #2 on: May 04, 2009, 08:19:04 pm »
I mean this with no disrespect but this is a very large hotel. Im sure most can take a short walk away from our con panels if they need a small break, or go outside. From what I have seen the bathrooms are generally worse than the hallways that we arent taking over. (Or maybe thats just the girls bathroom lol) Also, if we have a room for just cooling down I fear those who will take advantage and sleep there as opposed to getting a room...

Im sure if any person EVER pulled a staff member aside and said they needed a cool-down break we could easily let them into a quieter area.

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Offline kylite

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Re: Disability Needs?
« Reply #3 on: May 04, 2009, 11:52:59 pm »
often I have found man a person ducked into the viewing rooms as those tend to be the quietest spot in the con save the hotel room
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Offline Shadow Tec

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Re: Disability Needs?
« Reply #4 on: May 24, 2009, 02:23:42 pm »
In speaking with some of the directors on this issue, they (and myself) have concluded that it is not practical.  There are issues with programming/room availability, and the issues with having to staff it, (to keep out people who are sleeping or being disruptive).
I would suggest another option of finding a friend that has a hotel room you could briefly borrow, if you do not have one of you own.  But as it was said, if you feel you are having troubles, and have no other options, staff can assist you in finding a temporary quiet space.

Offline Rathany

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Re: Disability Needs?
« Reply #5 on: August 23, 2009, 04:43:11 pm »
The way into the dealer's hall this year will involve a ramp.  If this will cause a problem for anyone we highly reccomend contacting us ahead of time to make arrangements for alternate access.
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Offline thesirensings

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Re: Disability Needs?
« Reply #6 on: September 03, 2009, 09:21:34 am »
It might be a little late to mention this, but hey, you could always take it into consideration for next year. You could make stickers available to put on the badges of people with disabilities. You see, I was thinking of bringing my brother, who is autistic, with me next year. Right now he's 16, and he looks far older, so it wouldn't look odd for him to be wandering around by himself. However, if he had a clearly marked badge, the staff members would know that he wasn't supposed to be by himself.

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Offline Fevenis

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Re: Disability Needs?
« Reply #7 on: September 08, 2009, 03:42:56 pm »
Before I make my suggestion about, would this be the right place to discuss disabilities such as autism?

Offline kylite

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Re: Disability Needs?
« Reply #8 on: September 08, 2009, 06:07:20 pm »
yes
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Offline Fevenis

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Re: Disability Needs?
« Reply #9 on: September 08, 2009, 06:28:08 pm »
What do you think of visiably marking someones badge showing that they have special needs? We ran into a situation where we had to eject a kid with autism due to harassment and were unable to locate the person that was supposed to be watching over him, making the situation even worse.

Aside from marking the badge, I also suggest that people with special needs be with the person providing them those needs (kind of like the minor/guardian rule).

Offline Slash5150

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Re: Disability Needs?
« Reply #10 on: September 08, 2009, 06:47:31 pm »
I agree with FEV on that.

Also, I believe that disability needs people need to be given access to service elevators under two conditions

A) The reason they need to make it to location X is extremely important I.E. needs medicine or something that is like "CANNOT WAIT FOR NORMAL ELEVATOR".

and

B) Accompanied by staff.
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Offline BlackjackGabbiani

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Re: Disability Needs?
« Reply #11 on: September 08, 2009, 07:25:08 pm »
I wasn't aware until I saw a person on Monday afternoon wearing one that I could get a disability badge. This needs to be presented up front, as my legs were shot to hell from everything (I have moderate leg problems stemming from weak knees and ankles).
« Last Edit: September 08, 2009, 07:25:34 pm by BlackjackGabbiani »

Offline kylite

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Re: Disability Needs?
« Reply #12 on: September 08, 2009, 07:32:27 pm »
we actually were escorting a great many disabled attendees either with yojimbo or with our disabilities coordinator throu8gh the service elevators. it was a little hard to zip from one location to the next but we really did try our best. this year was definitely a learning experience.
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Offline Slash5150

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Re: Disability Needs?
« Reply #13 on: September 08, 2009, 07:52:34 pm »
we actually were escorting a great many disabled attendees either with yojimbo or with our disabilities coordinator throu8gh the service elevators. it was a little hard to zip from one location to the next but we really did try our best. this year was definitely a learning experience.

Ahh, okay, was just curious after seeing some posts that complained about it and what not
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Offline Hoshikage

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Re: Disability Needs?
« Reply #14 on: September 08, 2009, 08:28:14 pm »
As a disabled attendee, this year was very close to impossible for me, and my difficulties were minor compared to some others I saw. I've already had to seriously consider either not attending next year at all, or dropping almost everything I was doing this year (most significantly, giving panels) because it just was not manageable. Under most conditions, even at a con I can get around entirely unassisted; in order to do this however, I have to budget my standing and walking time carefully (I have bad joints; standing is the worst, followed by attempting to walk down anything such as stairs). That budget was completely blown by just how incredibly difficult it was to get around. I could theoretically try to find someone to escort me through the service elevators, but by the time I'd found a con staffer who could call a hotel staffer (and usually, finding the con staffer resulted in my then having to wait for the hotel staffer where there was nowhere to sit...), I'd have been most of an hour late to anything. Obviously, if I can't get anywhere on time I can't very well commit to actually participating in any kind of programming.

I will also note that the attendees were occasionally not very respectful of the needs even of people with very visible mobility issues (I don't expect them to know that I have them). I saw people pushing ahead into the elevators even when there were people with crutches or walkers waiting. I heard a comment of "why wouldn't you take the stairs from the 4th floor unless you're lazy." Well, maybe they can't? If I was staying on the 4th floor, I could have climbed up to my room during the con probably, but that doesn't help me get down to check out of the hotel with suitcases... Not all disabilities are blatantly obvious. And honestly, I shouldn't have to tell every single person I come across about my health issues to get an elevator, or a chair, or not get glared at. It's humiliating. I'd really, really rather manage on my own.

Now I know that the Disabilities staff is already aware of the problems, but I would like to suggest something that might possibly help make things less unworkable. Sakura-Con, when I attended this past year, gave me and my husband stickers for our badges with the handicapped symbol. Staff had been instructed to allow badges with this sticker to have priority. That way, we could both still attend events together that might have had impossibly long lines for me. If he wanted to go to something alone, he waited in line with his friends as usual. But this allows for an assistant to stay with the person they're assisting. But Sakura-Con does not have these elevator issues, so it's got to go farther here to solve the problem; the badges would only do any good with the regular elevators on floors where there are staff regulating the traffic. So my suggestion is to allow the badges marked disabled access to the service elevators. If there must be an escort, make it possible for any con staffer to do it or something; please don't make us wait for one specific hotel employee to take us somewhere. Standing for 15 or 20 minutes to wait for one guy can be incredibly painful. (Edit: Just saw the part about the yojimbo doing it - I never got this, I always had to wait for the one hotel guy. Maybe this got fixed later on - I gave up and started just going down the off escalators by myself no matter how difficult it was because walking down there was better than standing and waiting...)

I will be writing a letter to the Hilton about my experience as well, for what that's worth. I sincerely hope that something can be done to really address this problem; I had a great time giving panels this year, and they seemed to be very popular and well-received. I would be extremely disappointed to be unable to offer them again, or worse yet not be able to attend the convention at all. I am still in quite a bit of pain now though, and I just don't think I can do another year like this one.

Offline RemSaverem

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Re: Disability Needs?
« Reply #15 on: September 09, 2009, 06:03:26 am »
I had to advocate for folks with mobility impairments, to get folks to make space for them in the overcrowded elevators, from the 3rd floor. I love the idea that there could be disability badges and staff accompaniment that would allow use of the cargo elevators, but, for example, the cargo elevator to the lobby floor, when you exit, you have to go around a corner and up several steps to exit. So that's not doable for those in chairs!
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Offline Slash5150

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Re: Disability Needs?
« Reply #16 on: September 09, 2009, 06:30:45 am »
I had to advocate for folks with mobility impairments, to get folks to make space for them in the overcrowded elevators, from the 3rd floor. I love the idea that there could be disability badges and staff accompaniment that would allow use of the cargo elevators, but, for example, the cargo elevator to the lobby floor, when you exit, you have to go around a corner and up several steps to exit. So that's not doable for those in chairs!

I'm pretty sure you could get to the floor through the kitchen...I got confused in the building layout...I found these things out by accident
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Offline Shadow Tec

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Disabilities Apology
« Reply #17 on: September 11, 2009, 01:02:45 am »
To ALL Disabled Convention Attendees-

I would like to personally apologize to all those with disabilities whom had difficulties with the convention this year. The issues we had this year caught everyone by surprise, and unfortunately problems are almost always easier to find than solutions. But despite that I am working to form ideas and make plans to improve next year's convention. So please continue with your constructive criticisms and suggests in this thread, they have been of a great help so far.

-Andrew Duncan, Kumoricon ADA Liaison

Offline kagekara

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Re: Disability Needs?
« Reply #18 on: September 14, 2009, 02:04:23 pm »
... Under most conditions, even at a con I can get around entirely unassisted; in order to do this however, I have to budget my standing and walking time carefully ... Not all disabilities are blatantly obvious. And honestly, I shouldn't have to tell every single person I come across about my health issues to get an elevator, or a chair, or not get glared at. It's humiliating. I'd really, really rather manage on my own. ...

... Sakura-Con, when I attended this past year, gave me and my husband stickers for our badges with the handicapped symbol... But Sakura-Con does not have these elevator issues, so it's got to go farther here to solve the problem; the badges would only do any good with the regular elevators on floors where there are staff regulating the traffic... Standing for 15 or 20 minutes to wait for one guy can be incredibly painful...

I will be writing a letter to the Hilton about my experience as well, for what that's worth...

First, thank you for your detailed and clear description of problems as well as suggested solutions. My experience was similar to your own... except that the long walks to and from the service elevator, both from the hotel and in the Dealers' Room, rapidly exceeded my walking "quota" and made it impossible for me to enjoy my planned free evening convention time; I ended up going home early because of pain, and I am still recovering a week later. I absolutely needed to be able to use the regular elevators and the escalators.

Let me start with problems and then proposed solutions. Overall, the traffic and access situation was a nightmare, and I want to compliment everyone on staff for doing their best to deal with it on the fly.

I believe the primary problem that started it all was the Hilton's congested and slow elevators, affecting everyone, including both Con attendees and other hotel guests. I think the Hilton agreed to an event that was expected to exceed 5000 people by a significant margin... and should have known quite well that their elevators were unable to serve that volume of people. Perhaps they have never had a big event rent out so much of the hotel space before. I'm astonished they don't already have an access plan in place for large events on multiple floors; the space is old and strange, with difficult traffic flow between various locations.

Closing elevator access to Convention floors, and shutting down the escalators, were terrible decisions and caused unnecessary pain, distress, and upset to many Con attendees -- not just disabled attendees.

Personally, for me the service elevator was a failure as a replacement for normal elevator access to Con floors. The initial time standing and waiting for hotel staff, and the long round-trip walks to and from the service elevator, caused me unnecessary pain and suffering and cost me my planned participation in the Con after my staff and workshop commitments were over.

I think there was no excuse (it may even have been illegal) to shut down the escalators at any time. The escalators were essential to access Con activities downstairs in the Ballroom as well as to get over to the Dealers' area.

Later, Sunday or Monday? we weren't allowed to use the escalators (whether running or not) to get to the Dealers' area. When I got to the hotel, I was still in pain from the day before. The much longer distance -- being forced to walk from the lobby, out the hotel's front entrance and around the block to get to the Dealers' ramp and then down that ramp -- was a horrible experience for me; using the service elevator would have been an even longer walk.

The attitude of many hotel staff was inappropriate and sometimes offensive, but I'll deal with that issue in a letter to the Hilton, along with compliments for the hotel staff who worked hard for us with a positive outlook. The only concrit I have for our wonderful and hardworking yojimbo, on whom the heaviest pressure of this situation fell, is that we have a chronic issue, not limited to the yojimbo team, with inadequate communication among Con staff as to what is going on and what immediate changes have been put in place.

SOLUTIONS FOR NEXT YEAR:

I like the idea of badges. We need to consider what gets you a badge, walking the line between unnecessary red tape and the potential for abuse, and determine specific benefits or alternatives that we will provide. All staff (hotel and Con) should know what those are.

We can work with the hotel to determine a reasonable way to make elevator usage more efficient. A strong possibility is to have yojimbo directing access into the elevators from the lobby and Convention floors, ensuring reasonable access to both disabled and non-Convention elevator users. The service elevator can and should be used where possible to reduce traffic in the main elevators, but walking through kitchen areas (the direction shown me by a hotel staff person) is inappropriate during active restaurant hours... access during those hours would have to be from the hallways.

Why were hotel staff with carts full of luggage using the main elevators rather than the service elevators during our congested Con hours? Clearly that is a function that can reasonably be moved to the service elevators during times when the hotel has agreed to host an event with more people than the hotel can reasonably serve!

Can we evaluate expected crowds for different events and plan ahead for disabled access and traffic flow to those events, now that we know the problems in different areas? Perhaps some things need to be shuffled to different areas. Also, one strong suggestion not limited to disabled issues but relevant to traffic flow: If a long line forms, staff or yojimbo should do a count and inform people in line of where they stand in the line. At the time when my workshop area was being reset for the next event, there were more than 120 people in a long line. If a yojimbo had told them they were say, #50 to 120 in line for a room that would hold only 48 people, many might have left for a different activity rather than being disappointed after waiting a long time.

It is likely that these issues, which are specific to the Hilton, will require more yojimbo, and there are never enough yojimbo. I'm wondering if the range of abilities we require (or assume necessary) for yojimbo... including a level of mobility to deal with issues... might not be more stringent that all the tasks that yojimbo are called upon to perform, which sometimes, but not always, require being supermen and superwomen. Perhaps yojimbo duties could be evaluated, and some more limited tasks could be pulled out for a secondary staff group or yojimbo sub-group to handle. Not being yojimbo, I don't know if this is feasible and would leave it to them to decide.

Let's not forget the last, very important step once our concerns have been discussed and decisions have been made for next year: COMMUNICATION. Attendees and staff must be on the same page before the Con begins, and that means communication... during pre-registration, at meetings, in Con materials, and during the Con.

I hope we'll be doing ADA planning well in advance, and I have already volunteered to participate in that planning process. Discussion should take place beyond this forum, at general meetings, and final plans must obviously also involve the Hilton.

Can we solve these issues? I'm sure we can. I appreciate everyone's concern and determination to solve the issues we experienced this year, and look forward to an accessible Kumoricon 2010.
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Offline BlackjackGabbiani

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Re: Disability Needs?
« Reply #19 on: September 14, 2009, 06:30:06 pm »
And have it on the reg form to request a special badge/sticker/whatever (possibly with proof, but with prereg there'd be time).

Offline ThiefKingsHier

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Re: Disability Needs?
« Reply #20 on: September 14, 2009, 09:42:07 pm »


 I SUPPOSE you could say Im uuuugh.."disabled" and I hate this discussion. People get completely unnecessary ideas, when usually the answer is far more simple and gets lost in tangents of " this is/i'snt fair" 'Im offended by"

Its hardly productive.

First of all- an obvious problem was the crowding. I dont think much could be done about that.

The Pre-reg line Fri night-Was was with that? 'A lot of people' isnt much of an excuse. The line WASN'T moving. After about 20 minutes I just couldn't stand there any longer and had to leave and return in the morning.

For me the specific problem is that I look perfectly normal. I don't have a wheel chair or crutches so I don't even bother to ask to  move to the front ( also, I don't like to do that kind of thing ) bt I'd like to know that I COULD if I really needed to ( Fri night would have been one of those)

I guess what I'm saying is that the eternal problem is knowing who actually requires these privileges, and who doesnt.

Aside from really NOT wanting to wear a 'disabled beacon' on my badge, I imagine the only way to get one would be to release a lot of medical history which I REALLY dont want. *Siiiigh* It's complicated, isn't it?




Offline Hoshikage

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Re: Disability Needs?
« Reply #21 on: September 14, 2009, 11:25:34 pm »
I SUPPOSE you could say Im uuuugh.."disabled" and I hate this discussion. People get completely unnecessary ideas, when usually the answer is far more simple and gets lost in tangents of " this is/i'snt fair" 'Im offended by"

Its hardly productive.

Uh... okay. So this "simple answer" of yours is... what, exactly? Did I somehow miss it in your post? At least I made a suggestion. The staff obviously don't have to take it, of course, but I was at least trying to be constructive. What would you say is productive, then? Leaving the situation as it is? How are things supposed to improve if people don't discuss them?

For me the specific problem is that I look perfectly normal. I don't have a wheel chair or crutches so I don't even bother to ask to  move to the front ( also, I don't like to do that kind of thing ) bt I'd like to know that I COULD if I really needed to ( Fri night would have been one of those)

I also look perfectly normal. I also really really don't like asking to move ahead in line, even though I am simply incapable of standing for that long. We're in exactly the same situation here.

I guess what I'm saying is that the eternal problem is knowing who actually requires these privileges, and who doesnt.

Aside from really NOT wanting to wear a 'disabled beacon' on my badge, I imagine the only way to get one would be to release a lot of medical history which I REALLY dont want. *Siiiigh* It's complicated, isn't it?

Okay, so... are you assuming that you have to provide some kind of extensive "proof" that you're disabled and otherwise the con staff will deny you the help with access? No one ever asked me to provide a doctor's note or anything ridiculous like that. You don't have to "release medical history" to anyone at the con. (Con staff or hotel staff. The hotel staff never once asked me any questions at all about it when taking me to the elevators, didn't ask to see badge proof, nothing.) And the sticker I received at Sakura-Con went on the back of my badge, where it was not visible unless I needed to display it. I was never asked by anyone for any details about my condition. I think you're blowing this a little out of proportion...

Offline ThiefKingsHier

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Re: Disability Needs?
« Reply #22 on: September 14, 2009, 11:35:03 pm »
 I'm not blowing anything out of proportion. Just using what I know from experience-that generally you can't just say " Hi, I cant stand up for a long time. Give me privileges"

But, if that in fact isn't the case then I have no qualms.

Offline BlackjackGabbiani

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Re: Disability Needs?
« Reply #23 on: September 15, 2009, 01:02:09 am »
I'm not blowing anything out of proportion. Just using what I know from experience-that generally you can't just say " Hi, I cant stand up for a long time. Give me privileges"

But, if that in fact isn't the case then I have no qualms.


Actually that's how I managed to skip the reg line and go right to the front. I told a passing Yojimbo that I have bad legs and can't stand for very long and he took me right up. That was it, and I wouldn't consider saying "bad legs" to be any great or massive disclosure of medical history.

Offline RemSaverem

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Re: Disability Needs?
« Reply #24 on: September 15, 2009, 11:20:22 am »
I would like to propose:
(a) that the Disabilities Advocate (or whatever the title may be) be empowered to form an advisory committee.
(b) that the committee consist of
(i) attendees with disabilities, including: visible mobility impairments; mobility impairments not immediately visible; other types of chronic health concerns, such as asthma or diabetes; and mental health, learning, and/or behavioral disabilities;
(ii) staff with disabilities, including as many of the above categories as we have staff who self-identify with them;
(iii) facilities liason;
(iv) someone representing Reg.
How do you feel about this?
Should I make a formal proposal, or is that not needed?
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Offline ThiefKingsHier

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Re: Disability Needs?
« Reply #25 on: September 15, 2009, 12:04:09 pm »
I'm not blowing anything out of proportion. Just using what I know from experience-that generally you can't just say " Hi, I cant stand up for a long time. Give me privileges"

But, if that in fact isn't the case then I have no qualms.


Actually that's how I managed to skip the reg line and go right to the front. I told a passing Yojimbo that I have bad legs and can't stand for very long and he took me right up. That was it, and I wouldn't consider saying "bad legs" to be any great or massive disclosure of medical history.

No, no it isnt at all. Huh, that is pretty awesome of them.

Offline RemSaverem

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Re: Disability Needs?
« Reply #26 on: September 15, 2009, 12:06:13 pm »
BTW This year's Relations chair basically says (in reference to my committee idea) that there needs to be someone who knows the laws who codifies policies.
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Offline Animeman73

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Re: Disability Needs?
« Reply #27 on: September 17, 2009, 09:20:20 am »
Hello, this is Animeman73. Speaking as a person with a visual impairment I'd like to compliment Kumoricon for the good work it did on the pocket guides and the programs in making them easier to see print wise. The only real cmplaint I had was with the print on the maps. I thought that it was perhaps a smidgen too small. Other then that the map print the guide, the program, and the signs on the door was fairly easy to read. Bravo for the good job you guys did. And I will definitely see all of you next year.
« Last Edit: September 17, 2009, 01:17:19 pm by Animeman73 »
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Offline RemSaverem

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Re: Disability Needs?
« Reply #28 on: September 17, 2009, 09:34:38 am »
I have both obvious and not-obvious visual impairments, and personally I found it difficult to read the names of the panels in the boxes that were coded with slashes or x's or whatever to denote their age restrictions. Don't know what would've worked better, but thought it might be worth mentioning.
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2004: Beta Station Coord. 2005: Fan Creation Station Coord.;pre-event assistant to the con chair.2006: Fanfic Mgr/C.S. Coord.
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Offline kagekara

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Re: Disability Needs?
« Reply #29 on: September 17, 2009, 10:12:18 am »
BTW This year's Relations chair basically says (in reference to my committee idea) that there needs to be someone who knows the laws who codifies policies.

While the law is the bottom line, especially in terms of the hotel's responses to our suggestions, I'd like to think we'll do better than the bureaucrats in dealing with the actual issues. Anyone who wishes can read the language of the ADA here: http://www.ada.gov/pubs/ada.htm
But let's not get sidetracked from the real problems by the legal jargon.

I guess what I'm saying is that the eternal problem is knowing who actually requires these privileges, and who doesnt... I imagine the only way to get one would be to release a lot of medical history which I REALLY dont want.
I should think a doctor's note would be sufficient for Con purposes without sharing medical details... we're just trying to get people where they are going at the Con. We should focus more on the primary problem: movement of attendees at the Con, particularly with regard to elevators. The mobility-impaired issue is only part of that bigger issue, but it's the part that may get us cooperation from the hotel.

I would like to propose:
(a) that the Disabilities Advocate (or whatever the title may be) be empowered to form an advisory committee.
(b) that the committee consist of
(i) attendees with disabilities, including: visible mobility impairments; mobility impairments not immediately visible; other types of chronic health concerns, such as asthma or diabetes; and mental health, learning, and/or behavioral disabilities;
(ii) staff with disabilities, including as many of the above categories as we have staff who self-identify with them;
(iii) facilities liason;
(iv) someone representing Reg.
How do you feel about this?

As someone who was deeply involved with politics for many years, I've been on enough committees to shudder at this proposal... is Kumoricon really so bureaucratized that we need to require something this large and unwieldy? This sounds like the kind of thing politicians do to prevent actual results.

I fully support INVITING all the above to help, and more importantly, would like to see the committee solicit feedback and participation by having open meetings, but requiring so many reps on the committee could disempower it. More than seven people trying to draft something means a group that is likely to get stuck. We do need the input of more people along the lines you suggest, but requiring that the committee itself be large could be counter-productive.

I hope we can be energetic and efficient about coming up with specific proposals. I look forward to having an initial meeting to discuss these ideas, and I would like for that to happen before October 24.

Shadow Tec, how about setting up a friendly, unofficial gathering of interested people to discuss these things soon? Like a meet-up...
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Offline ThiefKingsHier

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Re: Disability Needs?
« Reply #30 on: September 17, 2009, 10:12:21 pm »


As someone who was deeply involved with politics for many years, I've been on enough committees to shudder at this proposal... is Kumoricon really so bureaucratized that we need to require something this large and unwieldy? This sounds like the kind of thing politicians do to prevent actual results.


I couldn't agree with you more. This kind of thing always leads to more problems than the one originally at hand. In fact, the very idea makes want to beat my head into a wall-repeatedly.

Offline Rathany

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Re: Disability Needs?
« Reply #31 on: September 18, 2009, 01:16:56 pm »
Whether it's a committee, or whatever, just make sure you work with the relevant Director.  That way any plans can be coordinated with other departments as needed.  If you just sort of form a group on your own without communication with the Board what you do wont be nearly as effective and you wont know whether or not you are working within our organization's capabilities. 

Note: Disabilities may be moving back home to Vice after elections.  Hence me saying 'relevant Director', as opposed to 'Director of .....'.
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Offline Shadow Tec

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Re: Disability Needs?
« Reply #32 on: September 19, 2009, 02:15:23 am »
This is Andrew Duncan, Disabilities Liaison for Kumoricon 2009.
Two things before I begin. First, I HATE bulletin boards (which the forums are a form of) with a passion, (just a quirk of my personality), so I am not on them as frequently as I should be. However I have read everything said so far, and have seen a lot of good suggestions, and value the input greatly. Second, the non-convention part of my life is not fun right now, so if I come off as being a little bitter I apologize.  It is not intended to reflect on the convention or anyone involved.

Just to clarify, the only "proof" of disability that the convention can require is the individual's word that they are disabled, no further proof can be required. (I am continuing to do research on this, and though there MAY be a few limited exceptions to this, this is how I hope to operate whenever possible.)

As for the ideas about a "committee", I agree that the bureaucracy of that is unnecessary at this point. As for an informal gathering I am not against it, but honestly do not feel like dealing with the logistics of it right at this point. As for doing it before Oct. 24, I personally do not see the point. I would prefer to wait until the new board is fully decided (member elected and Board elected members all in place). I believe this would create LESS communication issues, and less bureaucratic hassle.

That being said I would like to continue to use this thread on the forums, or private messages (which for me are routed to my email which I read more regularly) to continue this discussion. I also have a few questions that I invite you all to help provided input for. (They are in no particular order.)

How can we get the word out that you only need to ask for help if you are disabled? (If an optional discreet disabled sticker was used, how would attendees go about getting one? Without having to wait in line if they are unable to.)

How can we minimize the amount of abuse on the system? (There will always be some, but half the convention goers getting disabled stickers because they do not want to wait in line would be problematic.)

Exactly what would the disabled sticker mean to those whom it is showed to? (What "rights" would it give the wearer?)

Are there any specific points (regarding disabilities) that convention staff need to be trained on?

What exactly does the hotel need to improve for disabled persons? (My involvement with the hotel will begin much earlier this year.)

What can be done to HELP make convention ATTENDEES more aware of the needs of people with disabilities?

What can be done to improve the convention experience for hearing or visually impaired people?

Offline xcthulhux

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Re: Disability Needs?
« Reply #33 on: October 07, 2009, 02:09:33 am »
i don't know how to answer this thread specific to your questions, but i feel that i should definitely post about what happened involving my friend during the convention.

My friend mark is mentally disabled, and has a hard time around large groups of people.
During kumoricon last year, he had a schizophrenic attack, and began to hallucinate.

During this attack, my friends and i contacted staff, and they were very helpful.

They stood around him, and made sure nobody messed with him, while we tried our best to calm him down, eventually doing so.

Anyway, i really would like to thank any and all staff who helped with this, because im sure it brought on a lot more stress than you needed, and you still helped deal with it.

We told him about what happened later, as he didn't really remember much, and he wanted to thank you as well, for all of the help.

Anyway, thats all i have.
Huge thanks again.


Offline kylite

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Re: Disability Needs?
« Reply #34 on: October 07, 2009, 11:00:26 am »
i don't know how to answer this thread specific to your questions, but i feel that i should definitely post about what happened involving my friend during the convention.

My friend mark is mentally disabled, and has a hard time around large groups of people.
During kumoricon last year, he had a schizophrenic attack, and began to hallucinate.

During this attack, my friends and i contacted staff, and they were very helpful.

They stood around him, and made sure nobody messed with him, while we tried our best to calm him down, eventually doing so.

Anyway, i really would like to thank any and all staff who helped with this, because im sure it brought on a lot more stress than you needed, and you still helped deal with it.

We told him about what happened later, as he didn't really remember much, and he wanted to thank you as well, for all of the help.

Anyway, thats all i have.
Huge thanks again.



I was the ranking Yojimbo on the scene there and there was our resident nurse Mama Kat. We did all we could and I am glad it helped. and trust me, that was nothing in regards to stress. we love to help. I am just he is OK, I didn't really know what to do other then be big and scary to keep people away form him.
« Last Edit: October 07, 2009, 11:16:19 am by kylite »
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Offline RemSaverem

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Re: Disability Needs?
« Reply #35 on: October 07, 2009, 12:09:57 pm »
While I notoriously tend to be wedded to the Creation Station (other than during the panel on Religion in Anime & Manga), if anything comparable to the above happens on our floor, there are at least 3 of us in the CS with many years of professional experience working residentially with folks with developmental disabilities, mental illness, and/or dual diagnoses. There might be value in knowing who in various departments has specialized training in de-escalating clients in crisis (including people who do not have chronic disabilities but for whatever reason end up in crisis at or outside of con)--either to call upon us in a pinch or perhaps review pointers ahead of time.
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Offline xcthulhux

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Re: Disability Needs?
« Reply #36 on: October 07, 2009, 09:18:01 pm »
i don't know how to answer this thread specific to your questions, but i feel that i should definitely post about what happened involving my friend during the convention.

My friend mark is mentally disabled, and has a hard time around large groups of people.
During kumoricon last year, he had a schizophrenic attack, and began to hallucinate.

During this attack, my friends and i contacted staff, and they were very helpful.

They stood around him, and made sure nobody messed with him, while we tried our best to calm him down, eventually doing so.

Anyway, i really would like to thank any and all staff who helped with this, because im sure it brought on a lot more stress than you needed, and you still helped deal with it.

We told him about what happened later, as he didn't really remember much, and he wanted to thank you as well, for all of the help.

Anyway, thats all i have.
Huge thanks again.



I was the ranking Yojimbo on the scene there and there was our resident nurse Mama Kat. We did all we could and I am glad it helped. and trust me, that was nothing in regards to stress. we love to help. I am just he is OK, I didn't really know what to do other then be big and scary to keep people away form him.
Big thanks.
We are totally grateful for your help.

Offline Hawkeye

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Re: Disability Needs?
« Reply #37 on: October 09, 2009, 02:45:24 pm »
I will make sure Andrew hears about all of this, as I'm sure he'd appreciate the kind words.
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Offline TideWalker

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Re: Disability Needs?
« Reply #38 on: April 07, 2010, 04:43:42 pm »
How can we help people with disabilities? This is my first k-con, and I want to know if there is anything I can do to make someone else's experience better to better my own.  :)


First k-con and I cannot wait!

Offline Raiphin

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Re: Disability Needs?
« Reply #39 on: August 24, 2010, 02:33:15 pm »
Hallo! Not sure how many people are still reading this thread, but it suddenly applies to me so I've got questions... ^ - ^;;;;;;

I strained a muscle in my right knee last week (it looks like I replaced my dainty kneecap with a softball right now) and have no idea how much I'll be able to walk/stand during Kumoricon--currently I limp badly and can't stand for more than 10 or so minutes without wearing a brace. Do we know what I should be doing/who I should talk to at con? I worry most about waiting in line for the elevator, since stairs will probably not be an option most of the time. I'd love to be able to get some kind of "I'm kinda broken" stamp or badge or something, if such a thing existed. I could maybe go to the information booth after registration and explain my issue, or something? Hopefully my knee will be less swollen by then, but I really don't know.

Any information would be appreciated.
thanks!
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Offline BlackjackGabbiani

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Re: Disability Needs?
« Reply #40 on: August 27, 2010, 03:24:19 am »
I'm not official or anything, but I'd advise going up to whoever's in charge of the elevator or what-have-you and saying "hey, I'm physically incapable of standing for this amount of time, can I get a cut?"

Offline @random

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Re: Disability Needs?
« Reply #41 on: August 27, 2010, 03:55:01 am »
Hallo! Not sure how many people are still reading this thread, but it suddenly applies to me so I've got questions... ^ - ^;;;;;;

I strained a muscle in my right knee last week (it looks like I replaced my dainty kneecap with a softball right now) and have no idea how much I'll be able to walk/stand during Kumoricon--currently I limp badly and can't stand for more than 10 or so minutes without wearing a brace. Do we know what I should be doing/who I should talk to at con? I worry most about waiting in line for the elevator, since stairs will probably not be an option most of the time. I'd love to be able to get some kind of "I'm kinda broken" stamp or badge or something, if such a thing existed. I could maybe go to the information booth after registration and explain my issue, or something? Hopefully my knee will be less swollen by then, but I really don't know.

Any information would be appreciated.
thanks!

The bad news? We don't have any sort of stamp or badge to certify people, AFAIK.
The good news? You don't need one. Talk to staff about it whenever you need help, and we will take your word for it. (^_^) And we do have two elevators set aside specifically for the disabled.

Sorry if this means explaining the same problem repeatedly, but you don't need to go into detail - just let us know that your knee is injured, and we'll do anything we can to help. If there's anything else you're worried about, email disabilities@kumoricon.org and they'll be glad to help.
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Offline Raiphin

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Re: Disability Needs?
« Reply #42 on: August 27, 2010, 08:08:28 am »
Thanks a bunch! It's good to know about the elevators, I remember them so fondly from last year. ^ - ~
~Raiphin~
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Offline Soryko

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Re: Disability Needs?
« Reply #43 on: September 06, 2010, 10:10:13 pm »

...one strong suggestion not limited to disabled issues but relevant to traffic flow: If a long line forms, staff or yojimbo should do a count and inform people in line of where they stand in the line. At the time when my workshop area was being reset for the next event, there were more than 120 people in a long line. If a yojimbo had told them they were say, #50 to 120 in line for a room that would hold only 48 people, many might have left for a different activity rather than being disappointed after waiting a long time.

I don't know if anyone has quoted this yet but...THIS. YES. I remember waiting in line for the Kingdom Hearts pajama party forever, only to find out, that just as I reached the front of the line, it was full. It really sucks, especially when you could have been at a different panel by that time, or your legs are hurting due to health problems and such. It would help greatly in keeping the halls less crowded. D; It was horrible trying to walk around in there. People are told to stay against the wall, but it doesn't always happen. XD
But yeah, quoted because the suggestion is awesome. It should be taken into consideration for 2011. =D
« Last Edit: September 06, 2010, 10:14:51 pm by Soryko »
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Offline Saberchan

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Re: Disability Needs?
« Reply #44 on: September 07, 2010, 02:04:02 am »
I feel I should have spoken up this year when I needed help for my disability needs. Spending over 2 hours in the hot, stuffy parking garage just about killed me...not only is it hard for me to stand for long periods of time, I became severely dehydrated... and I wound up too sick to go to the pre-party...  :'(

Offline Phantom

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Re: Disability Needs?
« Reply #45 on: September 08, 2010, 06:56:29 pm »
Yeah, I also have chronic pain issues and have a hard time standing for long periods of time.  There were times when I should have spoken up about it, but, I didn't.

Also, a comment about lines and traffic flow...  I wanted to go to the FMA (Sonny Strait) panel, but, had to wait for the Kumori Ball line to go through.  That took about 20 minutes and when I finally got down to the FMA panel it was full anyways.  :(

Offline iheartexploding

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Re: Disability Needs?
« Reply #46 on: September 09, 2010, 04:27:29 am »
i often have to go to the umm "disabled line" if thats what it is called if i have to stand in registration longer than 20 min i have degenerative join disease and arthritis. so i am greatful you guys have that fast line for people who have problems that cause them to be greatly uncomfortable standing long.so faster lines for those who cant stand long are a great help.

the only real complaint i have is the main 2 floors dont have enough sitting areas,and i have to lounge a lot at cons and just make rounds,im certain others have to do the same,and when you do sit they always find it too far into a hall or something and you cant really do much else,it seemed like there were more people and less room.i dont know if anything can be done to make more little seating spots,but i know a few other people who have problems similar or worse than mine and we all end up dying at con in pain even with medicine.

i am however very happy that people were letting one of my friends in a wheel chair get the elevator every time to the first two floors,he had some trouble with that last year.

the staff this year were VERY helpful though,one of my friends had a panic attack and we had to get her medication in her and they quickly showed us from the ball to the first floor lobby where she could relax uncrowded,and they were very attentive and concerned,even told us where the nearest staff was incase it got to the point of needing an ambulance,i was EXTREMELY greatful they helped us get her out to a calmer place and they seemed to completely understand rather than panic themselves.so I thank those who helped out on that.

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Offline Kittyrinn

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Re: Disability Needs?
« Reply #47 on: September 23, 2010, 05:33:34 pm »
I have difficulty standing for long periods, and found the lines on Friday to be rather torturous. One way to reduce the number of people in line is to allow those who are staying as hotel guests to register as they arrive. As far as who is handicapped, if its an issue then anyone who has a handicapped parking placard should have something to prove that placard is indeed theirs.

Elevators: I never saw anyone attending to the elevators, and got in one that would only go back and forth to and from the lobby levels. No signs had been posted at this time, or if they were I simply didn't see them. All elevators should be available for all floors, and not have to wait for the one that will go up to where you need to be. It also would have been nice to have the escalators working, but with crowding, and loos clothing it was probable best not to have them on. I'm still recovering, and missed the Portland Pirate festival because my legs and feet are in too bad a condition to do much of anything. Partly my own fault, but that's just the way of it.

The print on the schedule was too small for me as well, and being functionally dyslexic, it was imposable for me to read the stuff in the boxes with the checkerboard pattern.

My final gripe is the semi formal dance... there were way too many people, and if the conventions own polices of who could and couldn't attend had been enforced it would have helped immensely.

Offline AllyKat

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Re: Disability Needs?
« Reply #48 on: September 23, 2010, 09:05:17 pm »
I have difficulty standing for long periods, and found the lines on Friday to be rather torturous. One way to reduce the number of people in line is to allow those who are staying as hotel guests to register as they arrive. As far as who is handicapped, if its an issue then anyone who has a handicapped parking placard should have something to prove that placard is indeed theirs.

Elevators: I never saw anyone attending to the elevators, and got in one that would only go back and forth to and from the lobby levels. No signs had been posted at this time, or if they were I simply didn't see them. All elevators should be available for all floors, and not have to wait for the one that will go up to where you need to be. It also would have been nice to have the escalators working, but with crowding, and loos clothing it was probable best not to have them on. I'm still recovering, and missed the Portland Pirate festival because my legs and feet are in too bad a condition to do much of anything. Partly my own fault, but that's just the way of it.

The print on the schedule was too small for me as well, and being functionally dyslexic, it was imposable for me to read the stuff in the boxes with the checkerboard pattern.

My final gripe is the semi formal dance... there were way too many people, and if the conventions own polices of who could and couldn't attend had been enforced it would have helped immensely.

I am very sorry that things ended up not working out for you on such a massive level!

I wish we could have been alerted to your needs during the convention, as I was in constant contact with the hotel and the Yojimbo who were VERY quick at making sure people with issues related to standing and needing assistance got attended to. A lot of them also have disabilities or increased needs and are very understanding that it is simply NOT an option to suffer through it!

The Sign-age on Friday was by all means my fault. Somewhere along the line wires got crossed and I guess they never got printed/sent to the printer - which was my bad! By Saturday mid-day we had most of the floors with signs but that really doesn't excuse not having them on Friday. I hope you can forgive me on that one though.

Elevator Attendant - We were cripplingly lacking in yojimbo on all the dates, they made due but that meant certain positions covered more area then they'd liked. I'd like to say that by late night Friday we had the scheduling down better, but it just didn't happen. Friday is of course, day zero, and since nothing much but setup occurs on day zero, we are still running around half dressed, but practice makes perfect and we hope to learn from our mistakes and make next year much more seamless!

The print on the schedule: that is something we talked about way too late in the game to do anything about... but we are coming up with some functional methods for those who cannot read the pocket guides, if you have some methods you know work best for Dyslexia or for printed goods, please forward them to the directors (AFTER ELECTIONS... or it will go to the wrong person!) so we can get some insight from those who would actually use these amenities!

The formal dance was a last ditch effort of some of our very awesome Attendees who absolutely LOVE the "formal" dance. We, Kumoricon staff, have tried running these dances and found it to be met with too much resistance and too much hassle, when other events are easier and more comfortable for everyone involved. It was posed to those fans of the dance (mainly a team of Ouran Cosplayers who are amazingly sweet people!) to prepare, regulate and plan the dance. I think they did an amazing job and really got an insight into how hard it is to really turn people away... Whoever ends up as the Director of Programing next year will need to make the hard choice on whether to keep the Formal Dance or cut it completely.... all complaints and raves will be considered in this process I am sure!

Like I said, and like I always say, if you need something from us, DO NOT HESITATE to get a hold of a staffer and ask them for help, we really really really want you to have fun, all of us... we crave your praise like some people crave... I dunno? PASTA!!! (there, thats my Hetalia reference for my lifetime)

When we get complaints, we all feel the hit. We want to make it better, so more staff training, diligent placing of the staff we do have, and a better understanding of the layout of the convention space is what we are striving for in future years. I hope you will still return and have fun with us as we make the move to Vancouver!

Thanks though, its always good to hear ways you can improve!

-Ally
2009 - Attendee
2010 - Facilities Liaison
2011 - Director of Publicity
2012 - Director of Publicity
2013 - Facilities Liaison
2014 - Vice Chair

Offline kylite

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Re: Disability Needs?
« Reply #49 on: September 24, 2010, 12:55:47 pm »
pleazse note: we did have tojimbo doing elevator duty, but it was riding the one elevator that went ot ballroom and top level. but it pretty well killed every yoji that did it since they ahd to ride it up and down up and down up and down.
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