Author Topic: NO METAL PROPS OR AIRSOFT GUNS ALLOWED!!  (Read 22488 times)

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Offline EcchiSpice

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NO METAL PROPS OR AIRSOFT GUNS ALLOWED!!
« on: August 29, 2006, 07:33:00 am »
I am sorry in advance - the hotel dropped this bomb on us at the general meeting.

Due to negotiations with hotel security, Kumoricon policy must be ammended as follows:

Absolutely no <strong>metal</strong> props will be allowed within Kumoricon convention space. This includes but is not limited to prop swords and stage steel.

**EDIT** Foil props may be allowed on a case by case basis. This policy does NOT apply to accesories made of metal, such as jewelry or Naruto headbands.

No <strong>masks</strong> or other items which obscure an attendees face from view may be worm while in the corridors and common areas of the hotel.

**EDIT**
After talking with the hotel, the concensus is that if hotel security asks you to remove your mask, then please do so. They mainly want to be able to see people's faces when they are in the main lobby. When you're downstairs, or by the ballrooms, you shouldn't need to worry about the mask issue.

No <strong>airsoft guns </strong>will be permitted. Plastic toy guns are acceptable, if not designed to fire a projectile. Guns must be obvious fakes at a distance of ten feet.

**EDIT** If your non-airsoft toy guns look real from ten feet, talk to the Yojimbo about ways to make the gun acceptable. (You may end up with 50 zip ties on it, but hey, its there.)

As always, props cannot be brandished  in any way. Only when posing for a still photo may props be held in any manner that could be deamed threatening.

The staff of Kumoricon entends our apologies to anyone adversely affected by this policy change. If you have any questions, please ask at peacebonding when you pick up your badge at con, or respond to this thread.

Please feel free to express your feelings here, but do not argue with the Yojimbo at con. They don't like this any more than you do.
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Offline Ronime

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« Reply #1 on: August 29, 2006, 08:53:22 am »
Wow, the hotel is more strict then actual state rules... at least you can carry a sword in public as long as its not consealed but sheathed...

this really hurts with a lot of costumes ^^;
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Offline Tinkeu

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« Reply #2 on: August 29, 2006, 09:20:16 am »
I have a claw made out of thick foil... Will I not be able to wear that??? It's really not that durable anyway and the only person it will be hurting is me as I finish it.... *crosses fingers* It's craft metal really... you can cut it with scissors.....>_<
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Offline JimmyDarkside

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« Reply #3 on: August 29, 2006, 09:59:45 am »
So....  a big shovel is out of the question then...  TT__TT  This is teh lame.  Seriously.
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Offline Irate Beldam

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« Reply #4 on: August 29, 2006, 10:24:16 am »
I can understand the guns needing to look fake thing, but...if they look obviously fake from ten feet, doesn't that basically mean you have to make an uber shiotty prop? :?



...And what's with the mask thing? I don't even understand that.


Omg. I can't see your eyes. YOU'RE HIDING A KNIFE IN THERE, I KNOW IT!


... :?

{ Because we all know the staff needs to see our faces. They must be looking for convicted fellons. :o }

Saeriously, masks?
Wtf. :/
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Offline kylite

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« Reply #5 on: August 29, 2006, 10:30:57 am »
my guess in regards to masks is the whole terrorist threat thing, everyones up in arms over this and the effect is it ruins a bit of fun for alot of people.  

Please understand that this is the hotels ruling and not the cons. We feel just as bad about it as you do.
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Offline Irate Beldam

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« Reply #6 on: August 29, 2006, 10:57:02 am »
Oh, of course.

I'm not even mad.


All it means it 50$ less dollars I have to spend on a mask I'll use once. XD



It's just the whole principle behind covering one's face that is precieved as a threat that confuses me. XD

It's kind of relative to the individual whether they feel threatened not seeing someone else's face, so them saying it's not okay is kind of...well, interesting, to say the least.
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Offline YariChuu

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« Reply #7 on: August 29, 2006, 11:08:47 am »
You can't obscure your face? Hurr...My costume involves a lacy black veil. It does blurr my features and partially conceal my face, but it's not like opaque. What're the judges rulings on that?
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Offline Panda

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« Reply #8 on: August 29, 2006, 11:15:04 am »
I think we all know it's not the con but the hotel making this rule. Unfortunately the con staff are the ones who will have to deal/listen to the unhappy cosplayers. Don't worry staffers, we love you! We just need to vent our frustrations. *hugs*

I just feel really bad for those fursuiters who spend hours working on a mascot costume to only find out the hotel made this rule. That really sucks. I just glad I didn't plan on wearing my Katamari Damacy costume for Kumoricon.

Not to mention all the amazing props we'll never see...it's very sad.

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Offline EcchiSpice

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« Reply #9 on: August 29, 2006, 11:34:12 am »
You can wear masks on stage, during cosplay judging, and in any of the events room. (If your watching Karaoke, say.)

The claw thing MAY fly. We'll have to see it to be sure. (Post picure?)Shovels are out. Wood, plastic, balsa, etc, are all okay.

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Offline Irate Beldam

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« Reply #10 on: August 29, 2006, 11:34:52 am »
Quote from: "YariChuu"
You can't obscure your face? Hurr...My costume involves a lacy black veil. It does blurr my features and partially conceal my face, but it's not like opaque. What're the judges rulings on that?


Hey, what if someone was from India and the women need to hide their faces? :/

Isn't that like. Racial discrimination? D:/
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Offline valliegirl

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« Reply #11 on: August 29, 2006, 11:50:03 am »
While I'm not effected, I can definitely feel the pain of the cosplayers.  I can also understand why the hotel is making these regulations, but I definitely think it's extreme.

I definitely feel bad for the Yojimbo and the rest of us staff that will have to enforce this.

Please, con goers, be kind.  ~_~
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Offline JimmyDarkside

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« Reply #12 on: August 29, 2006, 12:28:56 pm »
Ya, cause terrorists totally set a high priority to destroying hotels filled with kids in costumes.    :evil:  And they use shovels to execute their dasterdly plans.
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Offline Trumby

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« Reply #13 on: August 29, 2006, 12:48:11 pm »
Quote from: "Irate Beldam"
Quote from: "YariChuu"
You can't obscure your face? Hurr...My costume involves a lacy black veil. It does blurr my features and partially conceal my face, but it's not like opaque. What're the judges rulings on that?


Hey, what if someone was from India and the women need to hide their faces? :/

Isn't that like. Racial discrimination? D:/
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If they were saying muslim women couldn't wear their head covers, then that would be discrimination. But I have a feeling that if there ARE any muslim women, I have a feeling they'd allow them to wear them. That's a WHOLE different story.

The metal thing is simple really, a lot of cons don't allow metal whatsoever, simply because metal is a lot more dangerous (whether sharp or not) than plastic, wood, cardboard, pvc, etc.

I don't like the rules anymore than you guys (and in fact I am having to make new props because of the metal rule), but it's not going to ruin the con for you (unless you're one of those mascot costumes, then you're screwed at least while walking around).
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Offline Amerithe

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« Reply #14 on: August 29, 2006, 01:05:29 pm »
It would be most graciously appreciated if someone would construct a more detailed list of things that'd be unacceptable. I mean, where do they draw the line on jewlery and whatnot? I mean, it's a hairstick, you COULD kill someone with it, but it's not metal. What now? Um... I don't think that made too much sense, but then again I never really do... Oh, yeah, metal ornamentation in minor ways, ala jewlery. Like, are my earrings a threat? What about this ring? Don't make me spend three hours quizzing your staff on detailed intricacies, I'm very good at it.
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Offline JimmyDarkside

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« Reply #15 on: August 29, 2006, 01:09:48 pm »
:O  For toy guns that could maybe look real from 10 feet away, you should just put a stickey note on it with 'FAKE' in big letters.  XD
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Offline BlackjackGabbiani

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« Reply #16 on: August 29, 2006, 02:22:23 pm »
Are wooden props allowed? Quina's gotta have *something* kitchen-worthy...

Offline Kouta

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« Reply #17 on: August 29, 2006, 02:36:28 pm »
Also the title of this thread can be a bit misleading.
NO METAL PROPS, AIRSOFT ALLOWED!
It sounds like you cannot have metal props but airsoft is allowed.
Consider renaming to NO METAL PROPS, MASKS, OR AIRSOFT ALLOWED.
I suggest this for people that skim the forums before the con to make sure everything is set, but not read everything. This also adds masks to the thread title since that seems to be a common gripe in this thread.
This is just a little piece of my mind on what I thought when I read the title, which I may very well be the only one.
No metal can be pretty lame... but I have seen some people make some amazing stuff out of just cardboard like here http://forums.cosplay.com/showthread.php?t=76828 :3
Good luck to everyone, hope this doesn't hinder too much in your cosplay.
Also, as one last note, will veils still be able to be worn?
I assume it would be on how opaque they are, but still going to ask anyways.
Thanks~

Offline kylite

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« Reply #18 on: August 29, 2006, 02:37:26 pm »
heh heh *looks around* ummm, i think I hear a con-goer in need of help. *runs off quickly*
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Offline QElderHell

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« Reply #19 on: August 29, 2006, 02:53:09 pm »
So im guessing my black mage costume is out, as i have a thick black veil covering my face?

Offline BlackjackGabbiani

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« Reply #20 on: August 29, 2006, 02:55:32 pm »
A friend of mine wants to know if cardboard covered in aluminum foil is allowed. (for Winry's wrench)

Offline Antares

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« Reply #21 on: August 29, 2006, 03:13:54 pm »
Quote from: "JimmyDarkside"
Ya, cause terrorists totally set a high priority to destroying hotels filled with kids in costumes.    :evil:  And they use shovels to execute their dasterdly plans.


LOL

Not berry nice of the hotel to wait until now to spring this on us :-( If we had known ahead of time (especially since some other cons don't allow steel) we could have had rules in place and posted sooner as to what counts as metal / weapons (forks? claws? tin foil anything???)

The weapon's stuff I can at least understand - the mask stuff not so much. Does this meen we finally get to see Kakashi's face?

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Offline anime_fan810808

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« Reply #22 on: August 29, 2006, 03:42:52 pm »
I guess all the Anbu cosplayers will be showing their faces. Man....what a bomb at such a bad time.

Will spiked bracelets still be allowed?
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Offline maetel

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« Reply #23 on: August 29, 2006, 03:48:27 pm »
masks can be a big liability problem too~
example: cosplayer is wearing mask, thus cannot see, so he trips down the stairs and sues the hotel.

these rules are in place so the hotel won't get sued. please be kind and obey them.

(and don't whine so much. sheesh. it's ok to not walk around with a giant sword.)

Offline oishiidesuyo

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« Reply #24 on: August 29, 2006, 04:12:16 pm »
i'm a bit worried about those cosplayers who don't visit the website or forums - they might not know and have unpleasent news at the door...
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Offline antibishie

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Re: NO METAL PROPS, AIRSOFT ALLOWED!!
« Reply #25 on: August 29, 2006, 04:14:10 pm »
Quote from: "EcchiSpice"
No <strong>masks</strong> or other items which obscure an attendees face from view may be worn while in the corridors and common areas of the hotel.


I'm not quite clear on this... what areas are defined as the "common" areas of the hotel?  If I wanted to take a picture with my costume outside while the mask is on would that be acceptable?  

Bah.  I'm trying to see if there is anyway to salvage a costume that I've been working on for a year now.  It's almost enough to make me refund my room and just not go, though that would be stupid in the long run.
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Offline makichan

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« Reply #26 on: August 29, 2006, 05:33:51 pm »
Are plastic weapons allowed? I used pvc tubing to make mine and it took forever to cut it and get it just right, without it being metal >.<

I just feel sorry for all of those tuxedo mask cosplayers. Their identities are no longer hidden V__V
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« Reply #27 on: August 29, 2006, 05:53:54 pm »
and what about a chain....a dog leash chain.....
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Offline Ronime

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« Reply #28 on: August 29, 2006, 06:13:29 pm »
does a real wrench count? i dont see how that would be considered something to be banned...

*edit* how about metal props such as Ed's arm? I know some cosplayers actually have them made from metal...
beware the ronime XD

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Offline Negima

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« Reply #29 on: August 29, 2006, 06:51:46 pm »
None of this affects me at all but I have a question...

The rule about masks says you can't where them in the corridors and such.  Can people still wear their costumes that have masks in other areas?  And what about in the case that in a corridor someone puts on a mask temporarily for a photo?

Offline Keenon Williams

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« Reply #30 on: August 29, 2006, 07:47:42 pm »
So I can't bring my kunai? Awh. D=
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Offline Kimiski

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« Reply #31 on: August 29, 2006, 08:18:36 pm »
:x UGH
Okay, this new rule might completely screw over my sisters WHOLE cosplay.
Does anyone remember the giant P-Chan from last year??
Well, shes going as another giant character like that. (Cant tell you who, she doesnt want n e one to know)
How can she wear her cospplay without the head?
Im not about to tell her she cant, shes already stresssing over getting other peoples cosplayes and everything before time. I dont wanna be the one to die.

Her last year:


This really is bull.
Some people have been working on their costumes for months! And FOUR DAYS before the con they decide to tell us this???


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Offline Zennus

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« Reply #32 on: August 29, 2006, 08:20:11 pm »
AW....Bummer!  That means I cant bring my spiffy Keyblade...since a small part is made of metal...
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Offline Anza

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« Reply #33 on: August 29, 2006, 09:29:35 pm »
Quote from: "Zennus"
AW....Bummer!  That means I cant bring my spiffy Keyblade...since a small part is made of metal...


I'm pretty sure they won't be THAT picky. It's one thing to tote around a metal sword. It's another thing to have a small charm or even jewelry which I'm pretty sure they WON'T care about.

Weapons are one thing... jewelry is another.

As for Ed's arm? if your really worried about it just keep it in your jacket unless for photos. Same goes for the masks. Just because they say you can't wear them around doesn't mean you can't pose with them or carry them. I'm almost certain that if they saw people taking pictures and once your done you just carry the mask around they won't be so antsy about it.

The rules are kind of lame in a way as I've had a few props of mine not be allowed into a con or questioned. EX: Offical Tiny Bee controllers. I was told they looked too real before. Also a kunai I made out of paperclay was mistaken for being metal (though it still baffles me as to how.)

Just use common sense when it comes to the masks and metal bits.

Offline Antares

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« Reply #34 on: August 29, 2006, 09:48:05 pm »
Kimiski - that is a "!$@*!" awesome costume - OMG! I can't wait to see what else your sister has cooked up - at least you can show off inside the rooms / panels / cosplay contest etc.

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Offline Kimiski

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« Reply #35 on: August 29, 2006, 10:16:52 pm »
Quote from: "Antares"
Kimiski - that is a "!$@*!" awesome costume - OMG! I can't wait to see what else your sister has cooked up - at least you can show off inside the rooms / panels / cosplay contest etc.


We found a way around it.
Shes going to make the eyes ajustable so she can pull them up in the hotel, and pull them down for pics.
She says if anyone still gives her crao about it, shes going to point at her face and say "Can u see my face, huh huh?" Cause threw the eye holes her whole face is exposed. U just cant see her profile or back of her head. This years charatcer's eyes is closer together then last.


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Offline Squall

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« Reply #36 on: August 29, 2006, 11:38:42 pm »
Quote from: "kylite"
my guess in regards to masks is the whole terrorist threat thing, everyones up in arms over this and the effect is it ruins a bit of fun for alot of people.  

Please understand that this is the hotels ruling and not the cons. We feel just as bad about it as you do.
If this is true, the hotel has let terrorists win by showing their fear.
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Offline Squall

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« Reply #37 on: August 29, 2006, 11:40:06 pm »
Quote from: "maetel"
masks can be a big liability problem too~
example: cosplayer is wearing mask, thus cannot see, so he trips down the stairs and sues the hotel.

these rules are in place so the hotel won't get sued. please be kind and obey them.

(and don't whine so much. sheesh. it's ok to not walk around with a giant sword.)
Agreed.....though I do think the mask rule goes a bit far, and isomething the hotel should have mentioned long ago, not a few days before the convention.
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Offline Flatline

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« Reply #38 on: August 30, 2006, 12:40:56 am »
I was there at the meeting, and believe me, everyone was quite irate. This is the latest I heard about the mask thing. The worst part is that this was dropped on us this Sunday, so we had literally no time to negotiate. To everyone who has to ditch their props, please still come. We need you guys, and the con won't be the same without its beloved customers.
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Offline Dark-hobo

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« Reply #39 on: August 30, 2006, 01:04:48 am »
Here is my interpretation of the stage steel thing. Stage steel is anything that is meant to represent a real steel weapon for theatrical reenactment. Thusw eds arm COULD be ok(bring it just in case). Jewelry definately is ok, people wear rings and necklaces all the time. I would assume foil covering wood is ok as it does not present the threat live/stage steel does. Be careful with that kimiski you definately want to be careful when skirting the edge so close like that. I would suggest keeping time with the mask on to a minimum even with your sisters modification. Yojimbo however will seem to be taping all gun imitations with orange tape on the tip. PLEASE do not remove this if you are taped. If you do for a photo please immediately replace it. This seemed to have been part of the agreement and brownie went over it breifly. Not sure if it will be happening.

On a side note... we have NOTHING and I mean absolutely NOTHING to do with what you have and do once you are outside or off hotel property. hell even in your own rooms we can't do anything as long it is not brought out into our domain.

If anyone as anything to refute in that please do as I do not want to mislead too much :P.

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Offline Eternal Yamcha

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NO METAL PROPS OR AIRSOFT GUNS ALLOWED!!
« Reply #40 on: August 30, 2006, 03:26:39 am »
I had to stop reading thoroughly through people's posts.

First off, I'm down right pissed about it. Springing it on us the last minute, not having any information about it until a week before an event that may very well have THOUSANDS of attendees is just completely ridiculous. Sure, blame can be put on the con for not knowing the hotel's corporate policy, but in a contract, that information should be put there, or the con should have been informed about where to find out the policy. That's just bad business on the hotel's side. It affects me, I'm probably not cosplaying, but I know people have worked hard on their costumes and all that jazz and have to scrap their costumes or re-work their costumes with how many days left? Exactly... It's the principle of the situation that I am irate about.

If the hotel didn't allow people to wear jewelry, they'd have been out of business before it opened. And I do believe the "common" areas are the areas that we don't have any rooms in/we don't dominate the floor... The lobby is probably a common area, so is the restaurant and I do believe the areas where guest rooms are. I could be wrong and verification/clarification would be very VERY nice.

This is just bad, I'm probably blowing it out of proportion, but this is just bad business ethics in my opinion. We are at fault here too, since we should have really known about this a long time ago, such as asking the question, or asking where we could find out about the ruling on our props.

Just follow the rules people, hopefully we'll have everything defined and clarified... Come and enjoy yourselves, it's still going to be KumoriCon after all.
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Offline Tinkeu

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NO METAL PROPS OR AIRSOFT GUNS ALLOWED!!
« Reply #41 on: August 30, 2006, 08:27:24 am »
I'm just really worried about not being able to wear my claw... I put a lot of work into it and it's kind of a trademark thing, like with Ed's arm... I took a couple pictures to post... I seriously spent like four days working on it... oh and I also have to put the foil on my shoes as well......>.<

*sigh*

Here's the pics:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v188/tinkeu/cosplay/claw1.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v188/tinkeu/cosplay/claw2.jpg


And here's a picture of my character:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v188/tinkeu/cosplay/VincentValentineart.jpg[/u]


This is a real bummer for everyone... I'm downright depressed..... XP
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Offline Trumby

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NO METAL PROPS OR AIRSOFT GUNS ALLOWED!!
« Reply #42 on: August 30, 2006, 08:45:01 am »
Ohh, it's just a Vincent claw..to be honest, I don't see any reason why they wouldn't allow that.
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Offline Tinkeu

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« Reply #43 on: August 30, 2006, 08:48:59 am »
Really!? ^_^ Hopefully you're right then!


*glomps Trumby* You have no idea how that simple sentence just lifted my mood^^
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Offline Antares

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NO METAL PROPS OR AIRSOFT GUNS ALLOWED!!
« Reply #44 on: August 30, 2006, 09:00:18 am »
Quote from: "Dark-hobo"
...Thus Ed's arm COULD be ok(bring it just in case).


That would be what I would do - - there will be a lot of people who don't know about this who bring their props and will be asked to keep them in their rooms / in their cars. And, I do believe as long as we are not brawling in the streets, we should be able to find a place around the area to take photos legally.

P.S. Tinkeu - your claw is perfect!!! Good photos too.

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Offline Tinkeu

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« Reply #45 on: August 30, 2006, 09:02:37 am »
*blushes* why thanks... I spent a lot of time on it (and cut myself a lot) ...It's nice to get a compliment^^;;;
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K-con 06-Vincent Valentine, Final Fantasy VII
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Offline Lin

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NO METAL PROPS OR AIRSOFT GUNS ALLOWED!!
« Reply #46 on: August 30, 2006, 09:21:15 am »
Aww poor {m} she loves her Kakashi mask! Oh well!*shrugs* We will work around this!
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Offline Tinkeu

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NO METAL PROPS OR AIRSOFT GUNS ALLOWED!!
« Reply #47 on: August 30, 2006, 09:28:32 am »
I think the mask rule is even worse than the metal/sword thing >.< Because masks are usually more part of the outfit than anything.... *pats {m}* I have a friend with a mask as part of the outfit as well... It really is just something we have to work around....
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Offline EcchiSpice

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NO METAL PROPS OR AIRSOFT GUNS ALLOWED!!
« Reply #48 on: August 30, 2006, 10:25:07 am »
Masks - Yes you can wear them while getting a photo snapped.
Bring your masks, wear them, just not when you are moving around in a corridor, hallway, or lobby.

Veils are fine as long as you can see where you are going.

Common areas means anything not in a room ie hallways, lobby.  

Out of doors is outside convention space, and therefore is not affected by this policy.

Other materials - Plastic, wood, cardboard, etc. are all fine. Anything that would collapse when hit (ie aluminum foil or craft foil) are not counted as metal props, and are also fine.

Ed's arm is okay. I look forward to seeing it.

If anyone has a questionable prop, please bring it, and let the Yojimbo see it. We're willing to check the items firsthand.  

As for asking this question, Yamcha, don't think that we staff are so STUPID as to not ask if cosplay and all its splendor are allowed when we write the contracts. Weapons policy was asked repeatedly from the start, as was meeting with the head of security. (Something which the hotel took 3 months to agree with.) Only when we finally met him, did metal weapons become an issue. This just happened to be a week before the con. The HOTEL did not know its own weapons policy, and in fact, had to contact its corporate office this Monday to be sure.

We've done our best to inform not just the hotel, but the entirety of the Janzten Beach area what to expect. I personally walked the entire area to be sure of this. Sometimes, they just don't get it until you shove a boken under their noses.
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Offline Vondan

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NO METAL PROPS OR AIRSOFT GUNS ALLOWED!!
« Reply #49 on: August 30, 2006, 10:49:35 am »
what about the K shaped Throwing stars I made out of Brass and copper they could be worn on a chain around the neck like al sharptons Hubcap
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