Author Topic: Political sidelights from a different (cosplay) thread  (Read 2523 times)

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Offline Prinz Eugen

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Political sidelights from a different (cosplay) thread
« on: June 18, 2012, 05:49:27 pm »
http://www.kumoricon.org/forums/index.php?topic=16941.msg765041#msg765041

Hello: There are some interesting political opinions possibly clashing on this thread above.
I wish to explore these off-topic ideas here.

Offline Prinz Eugen

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Re: Political sidelights from a different (cosplay) thread
« Reply #1 on: June 18, 2012, 06:17:02 pm »
Here is the original post.

I'm sorry, but there was not a single place in my post where I said that anyone deserved anything. I said social justice, which according to Google, usually means somewhere in the vicinity of "the idea of creating a society or institution that is based on the principles of equality and solidarity, that understands and values human rights, and that recognizes the dignity of every human being."

You're putting words in my mouth, and that's rude. That is, unless you're saying that nobody 'deserves' an equal society or institution, in which case you're being very rude.

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Now what if some people wanted to practice Japanese and decided to meet monthly at a coffeehouse and try out their conversational skills. Are they 'better' than the Lithuanians who meet elsewhere monthly to practice Lithuanian? No. But if the bunch of people who want to try out their Japanese were meeting and someone else says 'Hey, how come none of you are interested in speaking Korean?' that might feel a bit obnoxious.

That's basically what I just asked. "Hey, how come you guys are narrowing your focus to JUST Japanese anime and culture? Korea and China make the same stuff."

So a question like that is obnoxious? So far I seem to be the only person who's asked it, at least in public. Yeah, I get it. This is your personal opinion on the subject of my personal opinion (notice how I started with a disclaimer- "I know that this is a Japanese Anime And Culture Convention (capital letters so you know it's important), and far be it from me to tell you folk how to run your con,") but your opinion of my opinion seems to be that it's obnoxious and stupid of me to ask questions about a legitimate part of this con that I personally believe to be, if not handled incorrectly, then far too biased towards animation and culture of Japanese origin for the sole reason that it is Japanese.

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As organizations repeat their events, a tradition gets built up, and that can be a source of pride, interest, and dedication.

But that's just it- the 'tradition' up until now has been to ignore the rules whenever it suited people in charge of admissions and judging of the cosplay contest. In 2009 they made an exception for the costume of the woman that won Best in Show- it certainly deserved Best in Show, yes, but it was from an American-made webcomic of which the creators happened to be Guests of Honor. Does that mean that if Cho Jung-Man is present as a GoH I can still compete in the cosplay contest and be judged while wearing a Witch Hunter cosplay? By your reasoning I should be allowed to. The rules say I can't be. The tradition has been that it's perfectly allowed.

PS: I belong to a super-secret club about collecting things too! We collect small plastic karate bugmen and pose them in silly ways and take pictures. But we don't just talk about, or take pictures of, our karate bugmen! We also talk about and take pictures of the villains that those karate bugmen fight, small plastic color-coded sentai teams, and the sentai team villains! And wouldn't you know it, nobody fights about it! Because guess what, at the end of the day we know we're still doing something that the average person on the street would think is a little weird. Like collecting guns.


Offline Prinz Eugen

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Re: Political sidelights from a different (cosplay) thread
« Reply #2 on: June 18, 2012, 08:55:17 pm »
First 'social justice,' is a politically loaded term. Google is a private company with its own political bias, and not a final authority. It can be used to find information and opinions but, like the madness of crowds, mob rule isn't always correct - or just.

Here's another article and definition from a politically conservative source. Money quote: "National Association of Scholars reports that the term 'social justice' is today understood to mean 'the advocacy of more egalitarian access to income through state-sponsored redistribution.' "  (Underline emphasis mine.)

Similarly, this article on social justice references that the Green Party defines social justice is as:
 
“...based on the concepts of human rights and equality and involves a greater degree of economic egalitarianism through progressive taxation, income redistribution, or even property redistribution. These policies aim to achieve what developmental economists refer to as more equality of opportunity than may currently exist in some societies, and to manufacture equality of outcome in cases where incidental inequalities appear in a procedurally just system.”
 (Underline emphasis mine again.)

So, in my first response, I dismissed 'social justice' in that as a capitalist, personal freedom, and independence-loving American, I am strongly opposed to the underlined terms above. I believe in equal opportunities to TRY, (some of that is mentioned above,) but I resist and oppose attempts to make the outcome of my efforts the same as someone else's efforts if those efforts are unequal in intensity or effect.

Each one of us is a unique, unrepeatable experiment. Why shoud we NOT end up different? We should indeed be UN-equal in our outcomes. I have a RIGHT as a FREE American not only to work harder or smarter than others, but to KEEP the additional wealth that my efforts get - if I am successful at creating value and selling it at a good profit (including a better profit than my competitors.) On the other hand if I am less successful, I shouldn't claim any right to confiscate the wealth or property of others who have done greater things than I have - and I don't think you should either.

So yes, I oppose much of 'social justice' as defined above.
Stating so and stating my reasons does not make me 'rude,' by the way.
None of this is personally focused - this is just my general political opionion.
« Last Edit: June 18, 2012, 09:48:04 pm by Prinz Eugen »

Offline Prinz Eugen

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Re: Political sidelights from a different (cosplay) thread
« Reply #3 on: June 18, 2012, 09:04:09 pm »
Quote
That's basically what I just asked. "Hey, how come you guys are narrowing your focus to JUST Japanese anime and culture? Korea and China make the same stuff."

So a question like that is obnoxious? So far I seem to be the only person who's asked it, at least in public. Yeah, I get it. This is your personal opinion on the subject of my personal opinion (notice how I started with a disclaimer- "I know that this is a Japanese Anime And Culture Convention (capital letters so you know it's important), and far be it from me to tell you folk how to run your con,") but your opinion of my opinion seems to be that it's obnoxious and stupid of me to ask questions about a legitimate part of this con that I personally believe to be, if not handled incorrectly, then far too biased towards animation and culture of Japanese origin for the sole reason that it is Japanese.

What I would feel in this example is that it's not wrong to ask once or twice, but if the group says "Yes, we heard your question and no, we're not interested,' then (a) continuing to repeat the question so as to disrupt the function of the group (the conversation club in the example) or (b) attempting to insist that the group change in order to accommodate the demand - yeah that would be impolite or obnoxious. Asking once or twice - fine. But be ready to walk away with 'No, thank you, we're not interested' as an answer. The go off and find or start your own group of interested people.

This is just like sales. The sales guy made a presentation. The prospect gave him a fair look at what he was proposing, and said 'No thanks, I'm fine.' It is now time for the salesman to go away. Otherwise, yes, the sales guy would be turning into a pest.
Nothing personal, just an example. Fair enough?


 
« Last Edit: June 18, 2012, 09:56:28 pm by Prinz Eugen »

Offline Prinz Eugen

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Re: Political sidelights from a different (cosplay) thread
« Reply #4 on: June 18, 2012, 09:39:50 pm »
Quote
But that's just it- the 'tradition' up until now has been to ignore the rules whenever it suited people in charge of admissions and judging of the cosplay contest. In 2009 they made an exception for the costume of the woman that won Best in Show- it certainly deserved Best in Show, yes, but it was from an American-made webcomic of which the creators happened to be Guests of Honor. Does that mean that if Cho Jung-Man is present as a GoH I can still compete in the cosplay contest and be judged while wearing a Witch Hunter cosplay? By your reasoning I should be allowed to. The rules say I can't be. The tradition has been that it's perfectly allowed.  

Maybe an allegory here is that we're starting to take the training wheels off.

Kumoricon is still too small to afford the guests or bands from Japan and so we go with whomever the staff decides to bring in - honestly, that selection is made by Relations, and I know they are doing their best to round up a set of guests that is (a) of interest to the Kumoricon membership, and (b) reasonable, practical, and affordable to schedule.

But ideally a fan convention that starts off constrained to ersatz, local equivalent talent eventually gows up enough to take the training wheels off and seek out its true heart and core. Mid to far-off future steps I hope to see are overlooking the US dubbers in favor of 'real' Japanese seiyuu. Bringing in animators from Xebec or Madhouse, or produceers from Kadokawa Shoten, or Shonen Jump? Could you imagine taking a drawing lesson from one of THEM?!?
Learning go or shogi from some top-ranked amateurs?

« Last Edit: June 18, 2012, 09:52:06 pm by Prinz Eugen »